Life During and After Fundamentalism: Jonny’s Story

So Jonny, who blogs at Leaving Fundamentalism, just sent me his story on life during and after fundamentalism! In addition to discussing the indoctrination politically and spiritually that many children of fundamentalism go through until they cannot relate to or interact with mainstream culture, Jonny also tells the story of life with the ACE curriculum, a fundamentalist cirriculum used in fundamentalist schools and some homeschool settings. For Sheldon’s similiar story, click here.
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1) Give us an introduction on yourself. Did you grow up in church? What kind? When were you “saved” and baptized? Tell us anything else you want about your fundamental background.

 

I can’t remember ever not believing in God. I know that I prayed the sinner’s prayer when I was very young. I think I started praying in tongues at six or seven. It was something I’d heard my mum do a few times. It had been strange and scary to hear these alien noises coming out of her mouth with such intensity. After I heard her do it a few times I asked her what it was. She explained that it was the Holy Spirit inside her praying the perfect prayer..

I said, “I think I’ll try.”

“You can’t try. You have to pray and God will give you the ability.”

We prayed together for me to be filled with the Spirit, and nothing happened immediately. My mum said goodnight and put out my light. I lay in bed alone in the dark, wondering if it had worked.

Eventually, I plucked up the courage to try speaking. “Sandaracki sanderay,” I said.

Was that the Holy Spirit, or just me making a weird sound? I called to my mum, who asked me to show. I felt embarrassed, but I said it again. Mum confirmed that it was the Holy Spirit. And that was it. I could speak in tongues.

I was baptized when I was seven or eight. The guy who baptized me was a window salesman by trade, and he lived up to the stereotype. He took the occasion as an opportunity to try to convert all the unsaved family members who were there for the occasion. My grandad, who didn’t believe but had come along to support me, was highly offended by his sales pitch.

 

I always knew that I was different from other people, but I couldn’t say why. I also knew that, where I lived, being a Christian (by which I mean an evangelical) was something to be slightly embarrassed about. I don’t know how I picked up on that. I guess it was discovering that my school friends didn’t go to church, or that my brother was embarrassed to carry his Bible in public, and noticing that we always said grace before meals at home, but never when we were in restaurants. Little things like that helped me to feel like an outsider.(2) You said you attend an A.C.E. (Accelerated Christian Education) school? Tell us about this experience. What is the school like? How did you take tests? Did you find the curriculum to have a hidden agenda? Did you feel you got a good education, or do you feel you had gaps?

I went to an ACE school when I was 11. As I and the dozen or so guest bloggers I’ve had will attest, it can be a soul destroying experience. I’m at university doing a PhD studying these schools right now, and it will be all I can do not to write a thesis in response to this question. Just the fact that I’ve decided to spend three years of my life studying and critiquing these schools should give you some idea how much it affected me.

I need to do some more video blogs about this, because the way it works is so different from normal education, and you really have to see how it works to understand why it’s such a bad education.

In short, the biggest problem from an academic point of view is that the children mark their own work from answer books. This means that the best way to succeed in the ACE curriculum is to cheat. And even if you try not to cheat, you have a system that just tells you the right answer each time you make a mistake, so you automatically memorize it without necessarily understanding why.

Also, for the system to work, every question must have one correct answer, and that answer must be simple and short. That means questions that require any kind of thinking are out. The way the system is designed shuts down original, critical, or creative thought.

Most people get caught up on the Creationist agenda in ACE, which is bad, but I think the political agenda is even worse. The political content reads like they would find Conservapedia a bit too liberal. They actually state that it’s against God’s will for governments to provide welfare or healthcare.

(3) Were you isolated from those who were not fundamentalists? Did you have many friends growing up? Were you unhappy as a kid?

 Before I went to the ACE school I was relatively normal and happy. I gradually became more isolated and depressed. I had really bad social difficulties in my late teens, which I always put down to the fact that in ACE I’d worked most of my time alone in silence, and my social interactions had all been with a small group of other fundamentalists.

 

I was suicidal when I was 14 and 15. I reached a point where I couldn’t believe most of what I’d been brought up to believe anymore, but I also couldn’t reject it because I’d been indoctrinated into thinking that evolution was impossible and fundamentalist Christianity was the only truth. It left me with nothing to believe at all, and no hope of finding any answers. If you spend your whole life believing that, without the foundation of the Bible, you can’t know anything, what happens when you start to doubt your beliefs about the Bible itself?

(4) Has transitioning into mainstream society been difficult? Do you still feel disconnected from it?

It was hideous. I almost had a breakdown at my ACE school, so I went to a normal school. On my first day, another kid asked me to say “fuck”.

“What? Why?”

“Because I haven’t heard you swear yet. Go on. Say ‘fuck’.”

It was like he’d picked me up on some kind of Christian radar. I refused. Immediately, there was a witch hunt to get me to sin. I got more and more preachy, and alienated myself further and further.

After I left school I went to college, and managed to make one friend the entire year. I couldn’t speak to girls at all – and that’s not an exaggeration. I constantly felt that I was this weirdo outsider with a dark secret, and that I would never catch up on all the years I’d spent as a fundamentalist when I should have been learning to socialize with my peers.

(5) When did you start questioning it all? What was the hardest part of fundamentalism/Christianity to give up?

Questioning it was a gradual process. As soon as I went to a proper school, I started learning things which contradicted ACE. My history teacher taught us that socialism was in many ways quite a Christian concept, and I was absolutely furious. The indoctrination worked on me quite well. I refused to consider ideas that contradicted what ACE had taught me.

But the contradictions I learned must have piled up, I suppose, until eventually I couldn’t ignore them all anymore. I read Richard Dawkins’ “Viruses of the Mind” which just plunged me into agony because he was right, but I really didn’t want to agree with him. Whatever you think of Dawkins’ critique of religion in general, “Viruses of the Mind” is a perfect description of the way my beliefs used to work.

The hardest thing to give up was a black and white world view. Even after I stopped believing, I still wanted a moral code that was rigid, and everything had to be good or bad, true or false. Even musical taste. In my mind, the bands I liked weren’t just good, they were right. And people with other tastes weren’t different, they were incorrect.

(6) Do you struggle with feeling alone on this journey away from Christianity and fundamentalism? Have you found a community here on the internet who understands, and if so which blogs do you recommend for those leaving fundamentalism?

I certainly did, although I feel alright now. I blogged about this recently for the Rationalist Association. I think there’s a need for communities more generally, and there should be an alternative for people who aren’t religious. I’ve certainly felt great about finding other people online who agree with me about ACE. So few people have heard of it that it’s really difficult to get people to notice. I really appreciate the guest bloggers who have shared their stories on my site.

I like Recovering Agnostic, who’s always honest without being preachy. Sheldon Cooper has done everything he can to help me out. And honestly, I love this blog! Everybody, read Wide Open Ground.

There are tons of great blogs; I almost don’t want to start listing them for fear of leaving some out. Ex-fundy was another good one, even though Lorena is now retired.

(7) When did you first start realizing God might not exist, and what was the key factor that led you to this realization? Were you sad to give Christianity up? Indifferent? Relieved?

Like I said, when I was about 16 I reached a point where I really had no idea about anything anymore. But then I fell in love with this fundamentalist girl, and I threw myself back into God in a big way, thinking that would make her attracted to me. It didn’t work.

For some reason, the possibility that there might be a God haunted me long after I stopped thinking it was likely. I read all the arguments, and I concluded that, if God does exist in the form I used to believe, then he is a bastard. But I couldn’t let that go. I was like, “Well, maybe God is a bastard. What makes us think that God should be good? If there is a God, why would he have the same standards as us? And what if my thinking this is making God really mad and sealing my doom?”

That really bothered me, and it was a painful time that lasted a couple of years. I think, ultimately, I realized that if you’re going to believe something just because you can’t disprove it, then you up believing in almost anything. I concluded that there could be a God, but if there is, it is nothing like any major religion’s concept of God. It is probably fundamentally unknowable. So then I just stopped worrying about it. I was reluctant to call myself an atheist for ages because I was afraid of being dogmatic ever again, after my brush with fundamentalism.

(8) Where are you today? What are your views about religion/politics?

Today I’m an atheist. I wouldn’t say dogmatically that there is no God, but I can’t see any reason to believe in one. If no one had ever told me about God, I don’t think I would ever have dreamed him up for myself. So I endorse that ‘weak’ sense of atheism, which is that I have no sense of God and see no evidence for one, but I don’t claim there definitely isn’t one.

My political views are rapidly lurching to the left. Funnily enough, the political indoctrination hung around the longest. Even when I’d rejected everything else ACE taught me, I was still furiously right wing. But I’ve learned that there were big flaws in their radical free market ideology just as much as in other areas, and now I’d like to see politics that takes care of the poor and the planet.

I also think we should impose regulations on faith schools to ensure that they meet academic standards, and they don’t indoctrinate in the way that ACE did to me.

If you left fundamentalism, leave a comment below and share your story. If you want me to share your story in a blog post (I’d love to hear from those who have remained Christian, too), email me at wideopenground [at] yahoo [dot] com
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11 thoughts on “Life During and After Fundamentalism: Jonny’s Story

  1. These stories are so horrific. I think I remember the cubicle schools from way back in the early 80′s and swore up and down that I wouldn’t put my kids in those because it was like locking a kid in the closet form of education. Why is this legal? What was going through your parents’ minds? The “teacher’s” mind?

    While I know that it is helpful to tell your story, my heart aches every time I read but I must. I am still a Christian but not a fundie, not anymore. It hasn’t stopped amazing me that it is almost exclusively women and children that suffer. Never the dominant males? Hmmmmmm, wasn’t Christianity founded by someone that suffered and died in order to spare others not the other way around!

    • Because I went to the school for quite a long time, the ‘offices’ (our name for the little carrels) stopped seeming weird to me. It’s only since I started telling people about it and seeing their shocked reactions that I’ve realised how strange it was. Almost everyone’s reaction on hearing about it is horror. Like you, I can’t figure out what my teachers were thinking. I’ve tried asking them, but I can’t get a straight response.

  2. Just a word of warning about the use of cubicles in education. A corale or cubicle is often used within special schools, particularly with autistic children, who cannot tolerate others when they are learning. Usually, their teacher will be in the cubicle with them a lot, so they are not ‘locked away’ in one, it just reduces stressful stimulation. Many mainstream schools will have cubicles within the classroom for an autistic child to use if the larger classroom is too scary – in fact, they are recommended to do so. I think it depends *how* such equipment is used so please don’t see a cubicle as necessarily bad.

    I’m an ex-fundie myself, converted when I was 19, and very concerned about ACE. I regard it as abusive because it deprives a child of their right to a ‘suitable education’ (which according to British law they should have). However, as the mother of an autistic child I get a little concerned when I read about cubicles being evil on every ex-fundie site! My son loves his cubicle at school.

    • Anna, I understand because that’s *the* reason I have been homeschooling. The schools in Asia where we were did not have classrooms or teachers to meet their social needs. A cubical would be necessary for them. But the ACE way is just wrong. No one wants to put up a flag just to get an answer key and no help.

  3. Anna,

    Whatever people that work with autistic people find helpful particularly something that will make a child on the autism spectrum feel safe and not overwhelmed by the world that is good in my eyes.

    But to put non-autistic kiddos into little cubbies is likely to drain every ounce of joy right out of their souls. Contrast that to the stem academy that my daughter just got accepted into (public magnet school 475 applications for 200 seats) The kids spend a lot of time in conference with one another. They come and go as they please. The kids have an extraordinary level of autonomy and it is because they all want to be there.

    Such polar opposite philosophies.

  4. Thanks, Jonny, for the endorsement! :)

    I love your blog because of the great writing, and because of all the great work you have done to expose ACE, as a fellow ACE survivor, I appreciate that.

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